Surah al-qasas

[shindeiru]

Assalam alaykum brothers

Ahmed how are you. im still laughing at your last post to debunker hahaha, i smelled him a few weeks back already and had a confrontation with him, i thought i was the only one. anyway

i read surah yasin, i liked the translation. its is very literal, i can see you want to remain as literal as possible, thats good.

i want your opinion on a common expression in the quran found in surah al-qasas and elsewhere

إِنَّكَ لَا تَهْدِي مَنْ أَحْبَبْتَ وَلَكِنَّ اللَّهَ يَهْدِي مَن يَشَاء وَهُوَ أَعْلَمُ بِالْمُهْتَدِينَ

i always understood "allah yahdi man yasha" as "Allah guides whom wills to be guided" and i think this translation is as correct as "Allah guides whom He wills".
But the reason why i choose "Allah guides whom wills to be guided" is that, throughout the quran and in verses such as 19:76,68:7 including 28:56 quoted above, Allah declares that He knows who are the followers of the right way, and these are the people that He guides hence "Allah guides whom wills to be guided". Guidance is in fact a grace from God with which He rewards all who desire to be guided.

please let me know what you think, and especially if the arabic allows the translation of اللَّهَ يَهْدِي مَن يَشَاء as "Allah guides whom wills to be guided"

[AhmedBahgat]

[AhmedBahgat]

[AhmedBahgat]

Salam dear brother

I could not wait mate, this is because you made me aware of a fatal mistake in my translation, I have written a big article regarding such Mashi'ah explaining that Mn Yashaa must mean any of the people who wants to beghuided, I will try to find it inshaallah,

This makes more sense, because imagine a sincere human who wants to be guided, now imagine that Allah decided that he won't be guided, and in this case it does not sound fair at all, because if that is the case regarding guidance then Allah would have simply chose those whom He wants to go to hell, and the others whom He wants to go to heaven, i.e. we do not have to be tested

Let's look at the following verse which should make it clear:

I will use Shakir translation for now as I have not reached sure 42 yet:

42:13 He has made plain to you of the religion what He enjoined upon Nuh and that which We have revealed to you and that which We enjoined upon Ibrahim and Musa and Isa that keep to obedience and be not divided therein; hard to the unbelievers is that which you call them to; Allah chooses for Himself whom He pleases, and guides to Himself him who turns (to Him), frequently

42:13 شرع لكم من الدين ما وصي به نوحا والذي اوحينا اليك وما وصينا به ابراهيم وموسي وعيسي ان اقيموا الدين ولا تتفرقوا فيه كبر علي المشركين ما تدعوهم اليه الله يجتبي اليه من يشاء ويهدي اليه من ينيب

See mate what was said at the end of this verse: ويهدي اليه من ينيب, i.e. and guides to Himself him who turns (to Him)

See the underlined words, Mn Yunib, it must be referring to the people not to Allah, because the people are those who does the action of Inabah (turing to Allah)

Therefore Mn Yashaa, must mean the humans who want to be guided by Allah

And this should make great sense and be 100% fair concering Allah, as we know about Him

Take care and thanks for bringing this important point to my knoweldge so I can fix my mistake

[AhmedBahgat]

Salam dear brother

I could not wait mate, this is because you made me aware of a fatal mistake in my translation, I have written a big article regarding such Mashi'ah explaining that Mn Yashaa must mean any of the people who wants to beghuided, I will try to find it inshaallah,

This makes more sense, because imagine a sincere human who wants to be guided, now imagine that Allah decided that he won't be guided, and in this case it does not sound fair at all, because if that is the case regarding guidance then Allah would have simply chose those whom He wants to go to hell, and the others whom He wants to go to heaven, i.e. we do not have to be tested

Let's look at the following verse which should make it clear:

I will use Shakir translation for now as I have not reached sure 42 yet:

42:13 He has made plain to you of the religion what He enjoined upon Nuh and that which We have revealed to you and that which We enjoined upon Ibrahim and Musa and Isa that keep to obedience and be not divided therein; hard to the unbelievers is that which you call them to; Allah chooses for Himself whom He pleases, and guides to Himself him who turns (to Him), frequently

42:13 شرع لكم من الدين ما وصي به نوحا والذي اوحينا اليك وما وصينا به ابراهيم وموسي وعيسي ان اقيموا الدين ولا تتفرقوا فيه كبر علي المشركين ما تدعوهم اليه الله يجتبي اليه من يشاء ويهدي اليه من ينيب

See mate what was said at the end of this verse: ويهدي اليه من ينيب, i.e. and guides to Himself him who turns (to Him)

See the underlined words, Mn Yunib, it must be referring to the people not to Allah, because the people are those who does the action of Inabah (turing to Allah)

Therefore Mn Yashaa, must mean the humans who want to be guided by Allah

And this should make great sense and be 100% fair concering Allah, as we know about Him

Take care and thanks for bringing this important point to my knoweldge so I can fix my mistake

[shindeiru]

i wasnt aware of 42:13, its a very self-explanatory verse. there are early scholars who also interpreted "man yashaa" this way, people like Zamakhshari.
and let me know about your article on the subject. thanks brother

[BMZ]

Ahmed and Shindeiru,

If it is okay with you, I would like to express my views, on above 2-3 posts, after dinner.

I will PM my thoughts to both of you first. Is that okay with you guys?

Salaams
BMZ

[BMZ]

Ahmed and Shindeiru,

If it is okay with you, I would like to express my views, on above 2-3 posts, after dinner.

I will PM my thoughts to both of you first. Is that okay with you guys?

Salaams
BMZ

[AhmedBahgat]

[AhmedBahgat]

[BMZ]

Salaams, Ahmed & Shindeiru,

I have no disagreement on your thoughts but I wanted to bring up something which the paralysed Kafir mind brings up by quoting various translations. I will discuss it after this.

Brother Shindeiru brought up 42:13 but I would like to bring up 42:7-8 first and translate in modern flowing English (not literal) and I want your opinion on this:

وَكَذَلِكَ أَوْحَيْنَا إِلَيْكَ قُرْآنًا عَرَبِيًّا لِّتُنذِرَ أُمَّ الْقُرَى وَمَنْ حَوْلَهَا وَتُنذِرَ يَوْمَ الْجَمْعِ لَا رَيْبَ فِيهِ فَرِيقٌ فِي الْجَنَّةِ وَفَرِيقٌ فِي السَّعِيرِ


"WE have thus revealed Qur'aan in Arabic to you, so that you can warn the people of the central town and those around it, of the Day of Gathering, about which there is no doubt at all. One group has to go to heaven and another into hell."


وَلَوْ شَاء اللَّهُ لَجَعَلَهُمْ أُمَّةً وَاحِدَةً وَلَكِن يُدْخِلُ مَن يَشَاء فِي رَحْمَتِهِ وَالظَّالِمُونَ مَا لَهُم مِّن وَلِيٍّ وَلَا نَصِيرٍ



"If Allah had wanted, He could have made them one people but He admits whom He wants , into His Mercy. The transgressors will neither have any protector nor any helper."

Now, let me quote 10:99


وَلَوْ شَاء رَبُّكَ لآمَنَ مَن فِي الأَرْضِ كُلُّهُمْ جَمِيعًا أَفَأَنتَ تُكْرِهُ النَّاسَ حَتَّى يَكُونُواْ مُؤْمِنِينَ


"If your LORD had wanted, all on the earth would have believed. Will you then force people against their will, to believe?"

This shows that if Allah wanted to force people against their will, Allah could have done that easily. But Allah never did that.

You can see that I am not going into will or Will and that is why I used "If Allah had wanted" in my translation.

It is true that Allah will guide those, in whom Allah can see that their souls are inclined towards Allah, be it a minute fraction.

When Allah knows that others will not believe at all, Allah will let them go and wander. But Allah never makes people go astray or wander Himself.

My gripe is with the translations done in the past, which give the impression as if Allah misleads or misguides others to go astray. This problem arises with literal translation, whereas in the Meccan dialect of Arabic, especially that of the Quraish, it is simply means "Allah lets them go" but does not really cause them to go astray.

What do you think?

BMZ

[BMZ]

Salaams, Ahmed & Shindeiru,

I have no disagreement on your thoughts but I wanted to bring up something which the paralysed Kafir mind brings up by quoting various translations. I will discuss it after this.

Brother Shindeiru brought up 42:13 but I would like to bring up 42:7-8 first and translate in modern flowing English (not literal) and I want your opinion on this:

وَكَذَلِكَ أَوْحَيْنَا إِلَيْكَ قُرْآنًا عَرَبِيًّا لِّتُنذِرَ أُمَّ الْقُرَى وَمَنْ حَوْلَهَا وَتُنذِرَ يَوْمَ الْجَمْعِ لَا رَيْبَ فِيهِ فَرِيقٌ فِي الْجَنَّةِ وَفَرِيقٌ فِي السَّعِيرِ


"WE have thus revealed Qur'aan in Arabic to you, so that you can warn the people of the central town and those around it, of the Day of Gathering, about which there is no doubt at all. One group has to go to heaven and another into hell."


وَلَوْ شَاء اللَّهُ لَجَعَلَهُمْ أُمَّةً وَاحِدَةً وَلَكِن يُدْخِلُ مَن يَشَاء فِي رَحْمَتِهِ وَالظَّالِمُونَ مَا لَهُم مِّن وَلِيٍّ وَلَا نَصِيرٍ



"If Allah had wanted, He could have made them one people but He admits whom He wants , into His Mercy. The transgressors will neither have any protector nor any helper."

Now, let me quote 10:99


وَلَوْ شَاء رَبُّكَ لآمَنَ مَن فِي الأَرْضِ كُلُّهُمْ جَمِيعًا أَفَأَنتَ تُكْرِهُ النَّاسَ حَتَّى يَكُونُواْ مُؤْمِنِينَ


"If your LORD had wanted, all on the earth would have believed. Will you then force people against their will, to believe?"

This shows that if Allah wanted to force people against their will, Allah could have done that easily. But Allah never did that.

You can see that I am not going into will or Will and that is why I used "If Allah had wanted" in my translation.

It is true that Allah will guide those, in whom Allah can see that their souls are inclined towards Allah, be it a minute fraction.

When Allah knows that others will not believe at all, Allah will let them go and wander. But Allah never makes people go astray or wander Himself.

My gripe is with the translations done in the past, which give the impression as if Allah misleads or misguides others to go astray. This problem arises with literal translation, whereas in the Meccan dialect of Arabic, especially that of the Quraish, it is simply means "Allah lets them go" but does not really cause them to go astray.

What do you think?

BMZ

[salman]

Very informational and educational as usual!

[mahachap]

Wonderful post...